1. Without knowing Moore’s personal profession or how he tried to reconcile it with professed homosexuality as well, this general thought did occur to me about non-Christians who enjoy The Chronicles of Narnia and other stories that contain Christian themes or Messiah-figures.

    Many people love a messiah-figure in fiction, but they far prefer the notion of being saved from an External Enemy rather than from their very selves.

  2. Kaci says:

    At the risk of being a total contrarian: Don’t you first have to concede that if he’d written a protagonist that was both Christian and gay he’d have been completely lambasted? Regardless of anyone’s thoughts on the subject (and don’t try to read mine into this comment), isn’t that a legitimate question?

    Just sayin’. I may or may not post more. Who knows, Stephen; we may have to wrangle over Aslan not being Jesus, too. 😉

    • Kaci says:

      Snap. I’m sorry, Becky, I came over from the SpecFaith twitter feed, and didn’t check the author name before posting.

    • Turns out I’m not the only one writing C.S. Lewis-themed columns these days!

      Don’t you first have to concede that if he’d written a protagonist that was both Christian and gay he’d have been completely lambasted?

      It sounded to me like Becky’s question was more about Moore’s priorities: he’d rather write something about a gay superhero than a Christian one. Which profession, then, seems to have been more important simply based on that?

      At the same time, my sympathies are with his family and friends. I can’t help but think of a similar overdose-related death (intentional or otherwise) of someone who at the time was on top of his filmmaking game: that of actor Heath Ledger.

      • No problem, Kaci. I don’t mind being mixed up for Stephen, especially because he did such a good job of explaining what I was thinking. 😀

        I’m not saying it isn’t possible for someone to be gay and Christian — that’s between that person and God. But I’m asking, why was it more important to write a novel about a gay teen superhero than to write something that would point to God, as Lewis did in writing a story in which Aslan is the real hero.

        If Mr. Moore did not know Christ, I think it would be such a tragedy. But here’s the reality. There are undoubtedly any number of people who worked on the Narnia movies and who are not Christians. That they can love the stories, know them, want to be a part of bringing them to theaters and onto DVDs, yet not understand what the stories are all about, is frankly sobering.

        Becky

      • I’m not saying it isn’t possible for someone to be gay and Christian — that’s between that person and God.

        I didn’t want to make this the issue, but I don’t think I can just leave that statement without some editorializing.

        The Bible is quite clear that homosexuality is sin. But all of us sin, and I dare say, we have ingrained sins that we excuse and refuse to recognize as sins. Scripture says we Christians are not to quench the Spirit because we do quench the Spirit. The man living in incest in Corinth is the perfect example. He needed the Church to show him that his sin was not OK.

        If I’d heard someone say to me, There’s a man living in incest claiming to be a Christian, would I have thought, False conversion? Maybe, but I would be guilty of judging. I can’t know simply by seeing a person’s sin what his relationship is to Christ. Would someone have looked at the thief hanging next to Jesus and say, He can’t be a believer because he’s a thief? Yes, that was his sin, one Scripture does not record him confessing or repenting of. But I believe we can surmise that God forgave Him because Jesus said they would be together after death.

        In short, I cannot look at a person’s heart and must not draw conclusions from a mere action. (I can take a person at his word, so that someone who says, I hate God, I can believe that he does not have a relationship with God. Similarly, if someone says he has a relationship with God but lies about God, I think his words show he doesn’t know him).

        That being said, I don’t think we Christians should tiptoe around calling sin, sin. What the Bible declares to be sin, we should not be afraid to call sin, even though our culture does not agree. Even though our culture will say we are being hateful (though the opposite is true — the most loving thing to do is to warn someone about harm, and sin is spiritual harm).

        All that to say, I don’t want to be misunderstood — I don’t think Mr. Moore’s being gay means he wasn’t a Christian, but I do think homosexuality is a sin.

        Becky

      • Kaci Hill says:

        Har har, Stephen. 😛

        It sounded to me like Becky’s question was more about Moore’s priorities: he’d rather write something about a gay superhero than a Christian one. Which profession, then, seems to have been more important simply based on that?

        I got that. I think I was a bit surprised, is all.

        But I’m asking, why was it more important to write a novel about a gay teen superhero than to write something that would point to God, as Lewis did in writing a story in which Aslan is the real hero.

        I guess it depends on what he was trying to do with the story. Personally, I think Christians better be on top of all topics. I don’t know if he was one or not. I barely know who he was. But I do think Christians should be ready to handle whatever comes.

        But here’s the reality. There are undoubtedly any number of people who worked on the Narnia movies and who are not Christians. That they can love the stories, know them, want to be a part of bringing them to theaters and onto DVDs, yet not understand what the stories are all about, is frankly sobering.

        God causes the rain to fall on the righteous and the unrighteous.

  3. Patrick says:

    “Many people love a messiah-figure in fiction, but they far prefer the notion of being saved from an External Enemy rather than from their very selves.”- E. Stephen Burnett

    I believe Jesus encountered this in our world too. The Jews wanted to be saved from Roman oppression, not from their own sin. So many miss the meaning in the True story, that we can hardly expect them to pick it out of a fictional one.

    • Great point, Patrick. Jesus was standing right in front of the Pharisees, making His clear claims of divinity. I suppose they didn’t actually “miss” it, because they picked up stones to stone Him.

      But on another occasion, right after feeding the 5000, they asked Him to prove who He was with a sign. OK, so they missed the multiplying bread thing. YIKES!

      “Open the eyes of my heart, Lord.”

      Becky

  4. Jeremy McNabb says:

    From this article, I’ve learned two things: Perry wrote a novel with a gay protagonist and Perry’s faith was obvious enough that a gay-related publication listed it as a defining characteristic. I’ve toyed with the idea of a gay hero, simply because I think it allows the opportunity to challenge stereotypes and address serious issues. But Christian protagonists are a staple of Christian fiction and only slightly less present in mainstream fiction.

    From those two aforementioned points, I don’t think we can speculate on which he held more dear. This is Speculative Faith, a blog about speculative fiction, not speculative non-fiction.

  5. Christian protagonists are a staple of Christian fiction and only slightly less present in mainstream fiction.

    Jeremy, I don’t see Christian protagonists anywhere outside Christian fiction. Sure, novels written more than a hundred years ago had Christians, but even then they weren’t necessarily portrayed accurately or in a favorable light.

    But that’s not the point. I was suggesting that authors write about what is most important to us. Maybe others don’t.

    At any rate, I was trying to get to the fact that people can love a story and still not understand the underlying truth. When I was replying to Kaci/Stephen’s comment, I mentioned the fact that the probabilities are, many working on the movies may not be Christians. And undoubtedly many others who loved the stories as children have not come to Christ.

    To me, that’s a sad reality. I’d love to live in the fantasy that all who read such redemptive stories see Christ in Aslan and that their longing for Narnia becomes a longing for Jesus.

    That’s what happened, essentially, with C. S. Lewis. And that’s why I write. But I truly see, with a heavy heart, that won’t always be the end of the story.

    And by the way, we do feature fiction here at Spec Faith, but because fiction is really a means to seeing the world as it really is, we also talk about non-fiction topics quite often.

    Becky

  6. This is indeed sad news. Prayers for his grieving family and friends…

  7. […] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Timothy Stone, FamilyFiction. FamilyFiction said: RT @specfaith: Narnia Collides With Real Life – C. S. Lewis and his theology; Narnia and its impact on writers, on b… http://ow.ly/1brgFQ […]

  8. Jeremy McNabb says:

    I believe you have entirely missed my point. In calling it “speculative non-fiction,” I didn’t mean that we couldn’t find realistic life applications for speculative fiction. I meant that with only a handful of evidences, you were speculating on the reality of a man’s faith or lack thereof. You were trying to speculate on what was important to him, on the basis of a single published work. I hope that it can be said of me that my greatest statements of faith were not in printed ink, but in the relationships I’ve formed with those with whom I share this terrestrial ball. When we begin to question a man’s spiritual state and spiritual motives on the basis of only two facts, neither of which were statements he had made, you are judging that which only God can judge.

    As a sidenote, since you have been deprived of modern Christian literary characters, especially those who portray us in an accurate and favorable light, might I suggest the following: Moon Called, Blood Bound, Iron Kissed, Bone Crossed and Silver Borne, by Patricia Briggs, which have a main character named Mercedes Thompson who talks freely of her faith and wears a silver representation of a Lamb, in lieu of a cross. Jim Butcher’s Dresden Files feature Michael Carpenter, who is the epitome of Christianity in its holiest, most unwavering state. He appears in at least a dozen books. Dean Koontz gives us several good Christians including, but not limited to the main character of two novels, Christopher Snow. And I know it’s a comic book, but because he’s a favorite of mine, I have to suggest X-Men’s Nightcrawler, who had a very strong, evident faith.

    • I believe you have entirely missed my point. In calling it “speculative non-fiction,” I didn’t mean that we couldn’t find realistic life applications for speculative fiction.

      No, Jeremy, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. I didn’t assume that you had missed what I was saying. Here’s the key line:

      Not that I know the man’s heart.

      I am not speculating about this man’s eternal destiny. I don’t know what he believed. I do know it is incredibly sad if he didn’t believe the truth revealed in the stories he worked with. And that was the point of my post.

      We writers need to realize that not everyone who reads what we write (and apparently that goes for blog posts too) will get what we’re saying.

      Thanks for the list of books with Christian characters. Still hardly the “only slightly less present [than the staple in Christian fiction]” you indicated in your earlier comment.

      And by the way, have I said something to offend you that you have adopted a slightly snarky tone in your comments?

      Becky

  9. This is a really brilliant discussion. I just have to say that first.

    As for the Narnia books and stories… Rebecca, I see why you might feel saddened by people missing “the point” of the stories. But there’s part of me that says, does it matter? I mean, yes, it matters that people are missing the point of salvation in general, but if they miss the point of the Narnia stories, does that limit God’s ability to bring them to their knees in some other fashion? As a Christian, I’ve enjoyed MANY stories that are not “Christian,” and it’s totally possible that I’ve missed some overarching theme that the author wanted me to get, but I still enjoyed the story. I think it’s completely possible to be deeply moved and influenced by a story and still miss the intended or unintended themes within it.

    Regarding Christian protagonists… I think they *should* be portrayed unfavorably when it’s called for. To do otherwise is dishonest. No one is black and white. Everyone has failings. I think it would be brilliant to create a really multi-layered protagonist who is “technically” saved, but does horrible things–a Macbeth sort of character. Let’s address the issue within the safe community–let’s talk about saved people who do stupid things. It’s okay to bring them back into the fold at the end, but let’s not pretend Christians are perfect or always the guys in the white hats.

    But… This is why people at my church don’t like to read my stuff, so…. 😉

    Again, really great discussion. 🙂

    • Amy, you’re right, of course. God can work through stories or through some other avenue, however He wishes. As I said, it’s just sobering to me — and helps me understand a little more why some authors end up “preaching” in their books. They don’t want readers to miss the truth. But the fact is, people read the Bible and miss what it says or reason out from under it or dismiss it as myth, so why wouldn’t they miss truth in story? It’s something we have to accept, but it doesn’t mean I like it. 😉

      I also agree that Christians can and should appear in fiction as we really are, thinning hair and sagging middles and whatever other unseemly parts we’d rather not show right alongside our trust in God and generosity toward the victims of the Haitian earthquake or whatever else might characterize the “Christ-follower” side.

      Jeremy disagrees with me, but I’ve seen far more of the Dan Brown and Phillip Pullman view of Christians in fiction than I have of the Francine Rivers Christian when it comes to general fiction — novels, TV, movies.

      So when I was talking about portraying Christians, I meant real ones, not stereotypical hypocrites (at least give us fresh and interesting hypocrites 😆 ), weak-willed men, shrewish gossips, or child-molesting priests.

      Becky

      • Becky, you said, “I don’t see Christian protagonists anywhere outside Christian fiction.” When you said that you didn’t see them anywhere, I took that to mean that you didn’t see realistic, genuine Christians…well…anywhere.

        I didn’t think that you meant so-called Christians, or wishy-washy Christians. I knew that you were looking for genuine Christians. That’s why I picked some of my favorites. I could have included more, but I suspected that it would have been misconstrued as snarky which is apparently how it was taken anyway.

        Please do not mistake my economy of words for offense. I took none. I try to use as few as possible in the event that I find myself having to repeat them.

  10. Did I say “repeat?” Silly me. I meant “eat.” My bad. 😛

  11. Galadriel says:

    I agree about well-rounded Christian protagonists outside of Christian fiction…and don’t even get me started about homeschooling’s portrayal in the media, because that’s way outside the scope of this conversation…

What do you think?